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PurpleSquerkle
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 1:35 am    Post subject: Postnetwork Needs/Wants If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Alright, well, we all know we can't do anything to make networking come about any faster. It's all up to Birdsey now -- No pressure! Razz ... Mr. Green

Anyway, until then, we can discuss things it'd be cool to have once we can do online play.

OK, so first off, just general features that we could probably add now, even though they'd be much more useful for online play (due to there being more people):

Arrow Teams.
There should be a way to set your team (I did a bunch of colors for them before, for the capture the spork thing) before entering a module. Certain modules would support teams, and you could pick your team when setting up controls. We could have tons of scripting commands for them; checking what team you're on, doing things depending on your team, etc. Like:
tmpargument = redteam
IfOnTeam
And:
GetTeamFromTarget
MakeTeamWin
(or "MakeTeamLose")
And:
SetTargetToWhateverTeamWon
GiveMoneyToTarget
GiveExperienceToTarget
...There would be a bunch of teams (I think I had six or eight), though obviously we'd hardly use that many; we'd only need a lot of a ton of people were playing.
We should have little colored indicators (either arrows pointing to their heads or rings beneath their feet) showing what team people are on, too. And maybe a key that could toggle their visibility?
Arrow Cool multiplayer modules.
Capture the Spork, races, good old fashioned battles, and whatever else we can come up with. As many as we can do; that'd be great! Maybe even have an extra folder to download full of multiplayer maps?

Now, I don't know how the online code works, but here's how I envision it:

You click "multiplayer", and you immediately see a list of games. You can click on them to join, and there's also a button for starting your own.
When you start your own game, you can choose various settings, like the maximum number of players and whether not you'll let more people enter the game once it's started. Your computer would then act as a server and handle all the information; data for the other players would be temporarily sent to you (so obviously, people like me who have slower computers wouldn't be able to play with too many people at once). When the game finished, all the information for the characters would be sent back to their respective machines.

...Of course, it really doesn't matter how I envision it, because I'm not doing it! Very Happy
I just decided to share that, anyway.
Moving on.

There would also be a messaging system; it could show up on the to with other messages, and speech bubbles would appear on top of your characters' heads, too. The messages could be sent even when the game is paused, so if you wanted to stop and talk about something, you could.
You'd push the send message key, which would -- *gasp* -- actually do something. Then you could type something in and hit the message key again. Certain sequences of letters/numbers/symbols would make cool smiley symbols; someone posted examples once, but I don't remember who it was. At any rate, they were nifty.

Also, the number of times you or your team won and lost would be kept track of, and we could have leaderboards, maybe?
It'd be neat if every player had their own fancy online profile, along with how much they'd won and lost, how many games they'd played in total, the name, class, and level of the character they used the most, and the top three modules they played on most.
They could even have a reputation thing that you could increase or decrease (only once per week per person or something like that), so people could know who was really mean and rude, or who was an awful cheater, or whatever.


I think I had more ideas, but I'm done for now.
So post your crazy multiplayer ideas here!
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 4:39 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Bumper.
Car.
Races.
Peer2Peer.
Data.
Send.
Recieve.
End.
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woodmouse
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 6:19 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

GREAT! Very Happy And I have an idea:
Deathmatch, like Ash Arena (was that its name?) but it would be for Soldier starter. It would be a pit module, where would be soldiers and knights in the audience. First, when you enter the module, you pick 4 gladiator/soldier like items, like sword, lance, shield, spike make. Then there would be guards (same as in Bishopia Capital) that attack if you do something "wrong". For example, if you attack them. How could this be?
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bgbirdsey
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 8:38 am    Post subject: Re: Postnetwork Needs/Wants If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

A couple notes

1) It seems likely that the network game will always be an extension of the single-player/hotseat game (or vice versa). This means that anything developed for one version will be usable in networked and non-networked play.

2) As it stands now, every computer running Egoboo can act like a host. This is the way it was in the old networked Egoboo. In the new version, any computer will be able to host multiple modules simultaneously.

This is the minimum requirement for being able to move from one location to another. This will not be any kind of burden on the computer because the server will not be dealing with graphics, which takes the VAST MAJORITY of the processor time at the moment.

3) It would be cool to have a way to automatically download a list of "active servers" from a central login server. This does not seem likely unless someone can host the app on an existing server. You will probably have to link up games through chat or emails. Send each other your IP addresses and the times you will be hosting and hook up that way... Sad

4) The ULTIMATE GOAL would be that a computer could be set up to make a Multiplayer Persistent World. So, several people could keep characters on that server, level them up, do battle, play games, etc. In my mind it would be a cross between Everquest and Quake.

Everquest because it is there would be quests, leveling, expansions of the game world, etc. Quake because it is a fast gameplay style where you "level" very fast and no one worries too much about having to start over after getting killed.

This is very similar to how Egoboo is played in single player right now, and considering that the old level cap was 5, there was not much leveling anyway.

PurpleSquerkle wrote:

Teams.
There should be a way to set your team (I did a bunch of colors for them before, for the capture the spork thing)

...There would be a bunch of teams (I think I had six or eight), though obviously we'd hardly use that many; we'd only need a lot of a ton of people were playing.


This sounds interesting. For this to work in networked and non-networked play, maybe there could be some version of Egoboo guilds? The guild would be the team you played on when you entered a co-op area. Any player could change their guild at any time.

It would not affect the way that monsters interacted with you, but it could conceivably affect the way that human/elf/gnome NPCs did?



PurpleSquerkle wrote:

Cool multiplayer modules.


As it is right now, any module could be hosted and it will have the same login restrictions as it has on your local computer (i.e. you can't log an existing character into a starter module).

As far as games go, maybe there could be a way to make them "quest based"? You would start a game by taking a quest to "capture the spork", and when the first person/team/guild finishes the quest it would send out a system-wide message?

You could still design any modules you want. Things like the Ash Arena are much more suited to multi/networked, but could still be entered by anyone.

PurpleSquerkle wrote:

Logging on


It is pretty similar to what you're saying.

There is a "network" button on the main screen. Clicking on that allows you to host a module or join a module.

If you wanted to join a game on Zefz computer, you would have to have already typed in his IP address into the startup.txt, then you would go to "network", then to "join", click on the module Zefz is hosting, then click "start".

If you wanted to host the Ash Palace and then play it with your buddies, you would ho to the hosting screen, choose the Ash Palace, click "Host", exit back to the "Network" screen, choose "Join", select for the "Ash Palace" module that you just hosted, click "start game".

When you click on "start" in either of the examples above, the host would check to make sure you had the correct versions of the files and would send you anything you were missing.

There is no ability to change the settings at the moment, which is fine. The basic idea is that the network game is basically "hotseat over the internet".


PurpleSquerkle wrote:

There would also be a messaging system


Right now, we use the existing system. It uses the same functions as "send message near" to put a message up on another player's screen. At the moment, you hit a key ('m'?) and then type in your message and then hit return.

Speech bubbles would be cool.

There are sites where you can set up "guilds" for just about any game. I think we could do the same for Egoboo. All profiles could go there.

Not sure how to do leaderboards. We could keep the "high score" like they do in Nethack? Evaluate it every time you die or log out and update the high score table.

PurpleSquerkle wrote:

They could even have a reputation thing


factions would be cool, but it is not really in the source code at the moment.
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Zefz
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 9:49 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

We should have a proper networking part of the menu. Instead of typing the ip in startup.txt, it would be better to have the player type it in after clicking Join Existing Server.

Same with creating servers, where the IP address for that pc would appear when you click Create Server for easy address sharing.

And what about cross-platform OS? Can Linux join a windows server and vice versa?

Does Egoboo also check if the versions of Egoboo is the same as the one its trying to join?

SendMessageNear only sends messages to nearby players. It sounds realistic the voice of a player doesn't carry to the other side of the module. But it might reduce tactical talking while you are in the enemy fortress and the teammates are defending their fortress.
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woodmouse
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 10:18 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Network play would be cool. Smile
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PurpleSquerkle
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 12:13 pm    Post subject: Re: Postnetwork Needs/Wants If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

bgbirdsey wrote:

It is pretty similar to what you're saying.

There is a "network" button on the main screen. Clicking on that allows you to host a module or join a module.

If you wanted to join a game on Zefz computer, you would have to have already typed in his IP address into the startup.txt, then you would go to "network", then to "join", click on the module Zefz is hosting, then click "start".

If you wanted to host the Ash Palace and then play it with your buddies, you would ho to the hosting screen, choose the Ash Palace, click "Host", exit back to the "Network" screen, choose "Join", select for the "Ash Palace" module that you just hosted, click "start game".

When you click on "start" in either of the examples above, the host would check to make sure you had the correct versions of the files and would send you anything you were missing.

There is no ability to change the settings at the moment, which is fine. The basic idea is that the network game is basically "hotseat over the internet".

PurpleSquerkle wrote:

They could even have a reputation thing


factions would be cool, but it is not really in the source code at the moment.


Well, I realize most of what I said is not in the source code. But it could be. I can dream, can't I? Razz

Also, do you have to know what module the person picked? Or will it show up separately?
It's also annoying to have to know the person's IP address and when they'll be on.
Sounds a bit cumbersome.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 2:01 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

PurpleSeuerkle wrote:
t's also annoying to have to know the person's IP address and when they'll be on.
Sounds a bit cumbersome.


Zefz wrote:
Same with creating servers, where the IP address for that pc would appear when you click Create Server for easy address sharing.



If you think that typing in the IP addresses is a "make or break" issue, we need to start figuring out how we can get an application permanently hosted on a server with its own domain name.

That's the only way that can streamline this process.

[quote= "PurpleSeuerkle"]Also, do you have to know what module the person picked? Or will it show up separately? [/quote]

You will get a list of all modules that are hosted on the machines that you have on your list. All machines can be hosting more than one game. So you could end up with lots of games on the Join Game menu, some of which are duplicates (because 2 different machines are hosting Zippy City, for instance). There are labels to show what machine the games are hosted on.

Zefz wrote:
But it might reduce tactical talking while you are in the enemy fortress and the teammates are defending their fortress.

This is true. Most games that have lots of chat options have ways to \shout your command so that everyone hears it. I'm not certain that this would actually be good for Egoboo, though. Maybe there could be magical devices, spells, or walkie-talkies for that?

Zefz wrote:

And what about cross-platform OS? Can Linux join a windows server and vice versa?


ENet is multi-platform so it will work the "same" on those 3 platforms. The only potential problem is Mac because of the endian thing. The packet building and packet cracking uses endian-independent code, so it should not be a problem, even then.
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Zefz
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 2:08 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

I was thinking of spells and walkie-talkies (G'nomes) too. Maybe when an item with :[LOUD] idsz held in hand causes better communication range?

Those items would only be useful in networking though.

What if a team got a walkitalkie from a enemy team? Razz Maybe they could listen in on their conversations?
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woodmouse
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 2:29 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

QOQ! Very Happy
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bgbirdsey
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 3:00 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Quote:
What if a team got a walkitalkie from a enemy team? Razz Maybe they could listen in on their conversations?


mwa ha ha ha ha! Twisted Evil

Even having :[LOUD] in game would be too tempting. I think people would just add it to all characters.


Last edited by bgbirdsey on Sun Jun 01, 2008 4:33 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 3:03 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

@Bgbirdsey: You missed "d"...Twisted Evil
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PurpleSquerkle
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 6:02 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

They might, but seriously, they might give themselves 99 health, too.
I think it's an awesome idea; we should use it.
There could be different communications devices, so everyone can use them.
Like Arcane magi would use a "Book of Volume" and Divine magi would use the "Voice of Aaron," and fighter-types would use a horn, or something of that nature.
I really like the idea of stealing walkie-talkies (and their equivalents) too.

Anyway, what you said does bring up a good point.
We need anti-cheating measures.
It could be as simple as, like I said, a reputation system. The admins of games (presumably the ones that started them) could kick out people with bad reputations if they so chose.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 6:50 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Or crypting files (Or compressing which has the same effect for most people).
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PurpleSquerkle
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 7:03 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

But I don't want honest development to be restricted... Sad
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