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Bugs! (Egoboo 2.4.4b)
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PurpleSquerkle
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2007 8:29 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Hey, wait a minute...
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Why me...?
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 2:08 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

@Zefz:
Snow Troll: Ah, alright.
Water bugs in ice palace: I tried both settings, and it happened with both.
Tundra Bunny: Okay, that might be a good solution.
Elf: I just noticed another bug that might be the cause for the elf's ridiculously high mana return rate. I'll list it below.

Elixir of Mana: Alright, just wanted to mention it.
Lamps in Bishopia: Alright, hope this is coming soon. I need to get a Idea ! Very Happy
Divine Spells: Alright, I already thought something like that. Good to know anyway.



Oh, and now that I'm on it, I found even more bugs! Cool

Problem: If you attack the switches in the catacombs with some magic that has "friendly fire", the switch can be killed (or, e.g. with orb storm change its colour).
Solution: Make the switch completely invulnerable.

Problem: The engine seems to handle mana return in a very strange way - take the elf as an example. The elf has a mana return of 10 to 12 at his 1st XP-level, and an increasing rate of 1 to 2. However, after having reached the 3rd XP-level he already has about 45 mana return, what
leads to absurd mana reserves. The same goes, less radically, for the wizard: He's supposed to have about 3 to 4 mana turn, with a 0.20 increase per level - my 5th level wizard has a mana return of 12. Looks like a source code bug, actually. Oh, and by the way, if I remember
correctly, any creature that has more than 100.00 HP will instantly die. Don't ask me why.
Solution: This looks like it was a bug in the source code. Given, I have not the slightest knowledge about how to handle source codes, so I can't help on this one. By the way, imo the mana return thing should work similar to the mana boost gained by enchants: say, a mana return of, well, 2 makes the player regain 2 mana points per second. A mana return of 0.25 makes the player regain a fourth mana point per second, or one mana point each four seconds. This would actually be more intuitive than the current system.

Problem: If you have more than one tundra bunny and at least two of them currently are not in your pocket, they'll try to pick each other up as long as they don't already carry something.
Solution: Tundra bunnies are flagged as items. Just make tundra bunnies not pick up items with the ID for tundra bunnies.

Problem: The pistol hovers over the ground, just like the shovel did a few versions before.
Solution: Do the same to the pistol as was done to the shovel.

Problem: If you try to buy the book of morph in Zippy City and sell it again you lose $100 each time - you know what I mean.
Solution: Miraculously, it has a value of 100 - I don't know why you still lose your money.

Balancement Problem: For the fact that they give 25 XP - more than a squidgie, as much as a cobol captain or other strong enemies - mephits are too weak, in all variants. They often die in one hit, and don't attack much. And even if they hit, the damage they do is ridiculously low.
Solution: Make all variants of the mephit a lot stronger, and make them more agressive.

Oh, and here's another feature request. I know it should go to the suggestions forum, but it's too few to make a new thread about it imo.

Feature Request: Please add boss music to all bosses (not to mini-bosses though). It adds to the atmosphere and the dramatic, and the boss music is great, really, just as all the other music-pieces.
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Zefz
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 5:46 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Catacomb Switches: Fixed.

Mana Return: Shocked You are right. Something in the source messes up the mana points gained. +1 mana per level in 5 level ups equals to a total of 85 mana! I did some tinkering and I think I've fixed it (Hopefully!)

Max Life: 100 life. No creature is supposed to have that much hp. It should be a easy fix if needed, but so far I havent seen need to do so

The pistol hovers: fixed.

Book of Morph: Hmm yes very strange. Luckly this cannot be exploited and I rather see books were more expensive to buy than sell (Same with anything you buy actually).

Mephits are more agressive now.

Boss music has been added a few places, but I think we have too few tracks for every boss (Unless we use same track at every boss).
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2007 10:01 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Yeah, I actually wouldn't mind the same boss-track for every boss for now. We can then, if intended, still replace them with different tunes later.

Max. Life: Yeah, just mentioned it anyway.
Book of Morph: Yeah, but this is annoying if you just wanted to pick it up in order to see what kind of book it is, then you see "Book of Morph" - nah, don't need it, resell it - hey, where's my money!? Curse



Oh, and don't kill me please, but I found another bunch of bugs...

Problem: Knives bought in Bishopia can still be kursed (15% chance!)
Solution: Set its kursed-chance to 0. Should take no more than ten seconds...

Problem: Longbows found in different modules often have different maximum ammo, different (arrow) speed and different aiming. That can be confusing.
Solution: Decide which one you want to keep and replace all the other longbows with it (don't forget to set the slot number back). Should not take much longer than five minutes.

Problem: The crossbows in the paladin starter have a maximum ammo of 27 and a starting ammo of 50. I guess somebody mixed that up...
Solution: Change max. ammo to 50 and starting ammo to 27.

Problem: Although it's supposed to raise the jumping power of the owner, the bracelet of acrobacy (deamon lord boss) somehow lowers it.
Solution: Maybe the bonus is too high? I don't really know. Maybe the game dislikes jump powers above 20 or jump power enchants above 10.

Problem: The attacks of death mephits poison the player even if he successfully blocks the attacks with a shield.
Solution: No idea.

Balancement Problem: Okay, maybe it's just me, but in my humble opinion zippy city is way too easy to be killed and robbed completely. Even a lvl1-any-class can already succeed in that, gaining hundreds of zorkmids each time. It should be really hard to do, and hardly possible below the 5th level (again, in my opinion).
Solution: Make the guards a lot stronger (way more HP, maybe also a little faster and better armor) and give a few of them ranged weapons. Add a few more guards. Also, the shopkeepers don't fight at all; that should also be changed (and they should also be harder to kill). Then if the player attacks anyone, disable Export until all guards are dead (and somehow also tell that the player).

Balancement Problem: Yeah, spells gain extra power by the user's intelligence/wisdom. However, at the current rate of 25%-bonus - and a wizard can easily reach the maximum of 33 - this bonus may become quite devasting. Imagine a wizard with 30 INT, using a spell with a basic attack of 5-8. After adding the bonus for 30 INT, the attack will do between 12.5-15.5 damage!! That's about twice as much as the original attack!
Solution: How about reducing the bonus a little, say to about 10% or 15%? With a 10%-damage bonus, a wizard with 30 INT will still gain 3 points of bonus damage to his attack. That can still be a lot, but it's fair.

Balancement Problem: Hatchets do 3-5 basic damage, gain a 25% strength bonus AND even bypass shields. Quite a lot of power for such a common weapon that costs only 30 zorkmids, don't you think?
Solution: Reduce the strength bonus and/or raise its value a lot (90 to 130 sounds good).

Oh, just a side note, I don't want to be rude or anything - you guys are doing great work. However, those "balancement problems" are things that seem wrong to ME. I don't know what you think about them. Anyway, I'd be glad if they were cleared, but I won't kill anyone if you think those things are just right. I might try to argue against it, though.

Another short feature request...

Please start selling longbows and quivers in the dunlar smithy (preferably) or the gnome shop. I don't always want to use crossbows (and the paladin can't use those anyway), and quivers actually are nothing only known to rogues.
However, in order to avoid the rogue shop to become obsolete, please start selling poisoned crossbows there, and a few more rogue-type items (preferably not too much that can already be bought elsewhere).
If you sell those longbows that are faster than the crossbow and have 50 ammo, I'd suggest a cost of 100 zorkmids (compared to the crossbows' 90). For poisoned hand crossbows 150 zorkmids sounds fine.
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Zefz
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2007 11:37 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Ah good. No I think these reports really improve the game (My changelog is getting waay big!). So if anyone wants to join in with us on this debugging and balancing, dont be shy! Very Happy

Ill see what I can do about boss tunes. Maybe I'll do a few more boss tracks each release or something. Btw I managed to reduce music size by 8 mb without losing any real quality. yay.

Knives: Fixed.

Different Longbows: Fixed.

Paladin Starter: Crossbow replaced with Longbow.

Bracelet of Acrobacy: Fixed.

Zippy Guards: I agree. I'll make them much harder to kill. BTW anyone managed to take over Bishopia? Razz Defeating Zambini in his spellshop can be pretty though.

Mephit Poison: Hmm, ill check into it.

Intelligence Bonus to spells: I dont think it is. Many weapons give a 25% bonus to damage and don't require mana to use (A soldier can easly boost his strenght to 35 or so at higher levels). And more is that magical weapons often give a devestating 50% bonus to damage! I always thought spellcasters were a little underpowered in comparision to melee fighters. More discussion?

Increasing Hatchet Value is a bad idea methinks. Think of all the hatches found in dungeons (And in Starter modules) that can be sold. Rather either reduce damage, strenght bonus, attack speed or remove the shield ignore abillity. Suggestions? Oh and dont forget that hatchets are supposed to be powerful, but difficult to use. They have slow attack speed and can only damage one target at the time. Lastly it has relative low range. BTW crossbow bolts ignore all defence bonuses (Armor), nobody thinks this is overpowered?

I was thinking of keeping bows out of the dunlar shop, as bows were mostly for Elven shops. But I guess I can add normal bows and quivers into the shop. (And spice up the Rogue shop a little).

Please start selling longbows and quivers in the dunlar smithy (preferably) or the gnome shop. I don't always want to use crossbows (and the paladin can't use those anyway), and quivers actually are nothing only known to rogues.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2007 12:35 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Zefz wrote:
So if anyone wants to join in with us on this debugging and balancing, dont be shy! Very Happy

I'm already doing! Wink
Zefz wrote:
I managed to reduce music size by 8 mb without losing any real quality. yay.

Yay! Very Happy
This means it will take me about two hours less to download a newer version of egoboo. Yah-huh! Clap

Zefz wrote:
BTW anyone managed to take over Bishopia? Razz Defeating Zambini in his spellshop can be pretty though.

I didn't try yet... But I'm almost sure at least one of my seven 6th-level-characters will manage to do so! Twisted Evil

Zefz wrote:
Intelligence Bonus to spells: I dont think it is. Many weapons give a 25% bonus to damage and don't require mana to use (A soldier can easly boost his strenght to 35 or so at higher levels). And more is that magical weapons often give a devestating 50% bonus to damage! I always thought spellcasters were a little underpowered in comparision to melee fighters. More discussion?

Yup, more discussion. I actually also think a 25%-bonus to damage for strength for weapons is too high. I'd half almost all of the values given in the manual. But then again, that's my opinion...
Oh and by the way, how can a soldier have 35 STR? I always thought the upper limit for STR, DEX, INT and WIS was 33 (caused by the source code). I also never managed to get a character with any stat above 33...

Zefz wrote:
Increasing Hatchet Value is a bad idea methinks. Think of all the hatches found in dungeons (And in Starter modules) that can be sold. Rather either reduce damage, strenght bonus, attack speed or remove the shield ignore abillity. Suggestions? Oh and dont forget that hatchets are supposed to be powerful, but difficult to use. They have slow attack speed and can only damage one target at the time. Lastly it has relative low range. BTW crossbow bolts ignore all defence bonuses (Armor), nobody thinks this is overpowered?

I actually always talked about the hatchets buyable in the cities, not those in the dungeons (refering to the value). Also, I never really noticed that they're difficult to use - they have a high attack speed, at least with those characters I want to use hatchets with (Soldier, Paladin, G'nome). And that high speed actually chancels the fact that they hit only one target at a time. The range - okay, but cobols trying to block your blows although they can't don't move or try to strike back anyway.
About the crossbow bolts - they're very powerful, but not overpowered, because their ammo is limited (this arguement will be valid as soon as the crossbows used by enemies have reduced ammo). And they can be blocked, while the hatchet cannot. I wouldn't mind if crossbow bolts no longer pierced through the armor, though.

Zefz wrote:
I was thinking of keeping bows out of the dunlar shop, as bows were mostly for Elven shops. But I guess I can add normal bows and quivers into the shop. (And spice up the Rogue shop a little).

Normal bows and simple quivers - that's all I wanted. Thanks!
(As I didn't manage to locate an elven shop anywhere so far...)

Alright, I hope I helped a bit with this.

EDIT: Wow, now that's a large post, isn't it? Very Happy
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2007 7:46 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

I think you should have the armor on the oukskirts of Mr. Smithy and a bow/quiver shop in the Armor Shop area. The sign would say 'The Fletchery'.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2007 8:51 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

I don't mind what you do if I can just get longbows! Drool
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Zefz
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 2:23 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Quote:
Yup, more discussion. I actually also think a 25%-bonus to damage for strength for weapons is too high. I'd half almost all of the values given in the manual. But then again, that's my opinion...
Oh and by the way, how can a soldier have 35 STR? I always thought the upper limit for STR, DEX, INT and WIS was 33 (caused by the source code). I also never managed to get a character with any stat above 33...


33 is a little too low I think. What about 40 or 50? (Level 6 character with full magic items should not be able to reach the limit without magical temp buffs).

Quote:
I actually always talked about the hatchets buyable in the cities, not those in the dungeons (refering to the value). Also, I never really noticed that they're difficult to use - they have a high attack speed, at least with those characters I want to use hatchets with (Soldier, Paladin, G'nome). And that high speed actually chancels the fact that they hit only one target at a time. The range - okay, but cobols trying to block your blows although they can't don't move or try to strike back anyway.
About the crossbow bolts - they're very powerful, but not overpowered, because their ammo is limited (this arguement will be valid as soon as the crossbows used by enemies have reduced ammo). And they can be blocked, while the hatchet cannot. I wouldn't mind if crossbow bolts no longer pierced through the armor, though.


What do you think of making a 1.5 second delay between attacks then? (Except for some magic hatches or something like that).
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 7:24 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Like the bait.
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Chainsaw
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 8:00 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

The Bait's actually my favorite weapon in Egoboo.

As for kicking Bishopia's ass, did that, i just killed the guy in the g'nome shop, and set up the bear traps at the entrance to easily kill all the nearby guards, then used the gonnes and crossbows to take care of the rest.
( I did it with a 5th level G'nome, and of course i had a shield equipped. )
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Maxaxle
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 8:19 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

About the Bunny, I think there should be a part from the Helper Faries' Script: The game says "Hand's Off! (XXX Zenny)" whenever one of the Helper Faries grabs something in the store. Of course, they have no money, so they can't buy anything.
About the torches: That is SO messed up...the Brazier Script from the Water Palace should be used in place of the Bishopia City Brazier Script. I Am Currently Capitalizing On The Capitalization Of The First Letter Of Every Word I Type. Mr. Green
About the reselling of Book of Morph + every other really useless book: That is REALLY annoying, but I don't have a solution
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PurpleSquerkle
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 11:56 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Wait, how are there fairies in a town? I thought there was no way to bring those with you?

Oooh, we should make bottles!
Very Happy
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2007 6:22 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Rofl Clap *shudder* Ooh-that smilie is ugly. But it was fitting the situation.
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PurpleSquerkle
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2007 3:23 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Yeah, it doesn't really match the other ones either.
Oh, and by the way, that's one of my favorite poems ever (in your signature) Very Happy
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